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I'm tired of Sonic being Family Friendly

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JPC

Green Hill Zone
Dec 3, 2019
48
2
23
27
Hi. This is a thread to vent, after the disappointment I had with the Sonic Central that was uploaded on Youtube to celebrate the 30th anniversary of Sonic The Hedegehog.

Well. I've seen that Sonic Colors Ultimate is definitely going to be a remaster and no new content and that disappointed me, because I thought it was going to be a reimagining/reboot of the original Wii game with a more serious story and with Sonic not acting like a clown and Tails being playable. Not to mention that Roger Craig Smith will be back to play Sonic and I'm already tired of that. I would want Ryan Drummond back.

After that. There will be like a miniseries based on Sonic Colors titled Rise of the Wisps, which I don't like at all. Looks like a preschool series.

I don't expect anything from the upcoming 30th anniversary main game. Let's see if it's another game with boost gameplay where you will control only Sonic, possibly also Classic Sonic and some new gameplay but not playing with another character other than Tails, Knuckles etc. I don't want to get carried away by the hyper as happened with Sonic Forces.

After that. I came to the conclusion that Sonic has become very Family Friendly lately. And that's got me tired of it. To the point that the official YouTube channel was labeled as a kids channel and therefore you can't comment on it because it's disabled.

Sonic... WAS NE-VER FA-MI-LY FRI-EN-DLY... Proof of this was in Sonic Adventure 1 and 2, which told darker and more serious stories and had a strong narrative. More if you played Dark Story in SA2.

Another proof that Sonic was never Family Friendly, would be with the Sonic SatAM and Sonic Underground series and comics like Archie (Pre-SGW) and Fleetway. Which also told darker and more serious stories and were not centered only on Sonic, but on other characters like Sally and the Freedom Fighters for example.

If Sonic Colors would have been a failure. As much in reception, as in sales, as well as in critics. SEGA would not have turned Sonic into a Family Friendly product as it is today.

Because of all that. It makes me want to take matters with that franchise and make it go back to the way it used to be during the 90's and early 2000's. Because that was the golden age that Sonic had, not only in video games, but also in series and comics.

I wish there was a project that consists of a kind of Polymorphic Content about a new franchise that picks up what made Sonic great in the past, both in video games, series, comics and novels.

It will reuse the same things and elements of the blue hedgehog (characters, stories, worlds, lore, alternate universes, etc.) but in a different context, since it will not be mainly about platforming, nor will it be about speed, nor will it have Sonic as the main character.

But it will be stories more focused on a more complex narrative, focused on different characters from different POVs and betting on multi-genres (RPG, Adventure, Strategy, Open World etc.).

That this franchise carries the name of Mobius and is based on the old canon, that is the rejected canon of Sega of America that is the Sonic Bible. Leaving aside completely the official canon of Sega of Japan and Sonic Team. So there wouldn't be things like the Two Worlds. And that this directed to a more mature public that already grew up with the Sonic franchise and that was following it from the era of the Genesis or the era of the Dreamcast.

I want Mobius to be treated as a franchise as such, and not a Sonic spin-off, no matter how much it uses the same characters, worlds, universes etc.

And for it to be a franchise owned by SEGA of America. This so that SEGA of Japan can't tell the American division to make x changes and also can't sue them, so the Americans and any western studio would have the absolute freedom to make all kinds of stories in Mobius without any kind of limit.

What do you guys think?
 

X Spranp

Green Hill Zone
May 26, 2021
26
10
22
The franchise you just described sounds like something Ken Penders would make.
 

JPC

Green Hill Zone
Dec 3, 2019
48
2
23
27
The franchise you just described sounds like something Ken Penders would make.
I wouldn't describe it as something Penders would do. I would describe it something like a sort of metaseries. similar to the Marvel universe or with Star Wars.

And that it would be a franchise that is able to encompass themes that the Sonic franchise couldn't encompass or that it could encompass, but they had certain limitations and restrictions like it was in Sonic Adventure 2.

Being the theme of terrorism and casualties both civilian and military in the Dark Story. Because the military always sent robots and not human soldiers to stop Eggman. And if they were machines controlled by humans as in the case of the B-3X Hot Shot, they simply stop working after several hits and the pilot was always unharmed, there was no civilian presence to eliminate. Not to mention that in one part of that story Prison Island is destroyed but we don't see people die during the explosion.

Mobius should cover those issues, albeit in a more realistic way, ie. That there is presence of human soldiers or beings that are alive and not machines and that these die in the most brutal ways possible, nothing to stay there lying on the ground as happened in Shadow The Hedgehog. That there are civilians and that these die by x attack of x villain, that the machines controlled by someone on board end up exploding and that the pilot dies in that explosion and that when destroying x place, we see people die during that explosion.
 

Sotaknuck

Scrambled Egg Zone
May 27, 2020
53
68
63
40
I agree that Sonic should go back to its "more serious" roots.
The adventure games (and 3k too, with its short cutscenes!) managed in being serious without going overboard yet stll feeling serious.
Kids are able to enjoy a more serious story, honestly I think they would appreciate it more as well.

The game were never too serious or gritty, but they also didn't fall into the kindergarden level of bad narration we are enduring for more than 15 years now.

Characters no longer have their personality nor growth and this is affecting pretty much everyone.
Just look ad the original trio and Eggman as examples:
Sonic is generally an arrogant obnoxious one liner guy compared to the a smart hero he was in the Adventure games.
Tails lost his determination and devolved into a shy coward.
Knuckles...uh... I don't want to talk about Knuckles. Poor Knuckles.
Eggman is little more than a clown instead of a threat, never taken seriously when he should be percieved as one. While he might have been clownish at times he still was acknowledged as a dangerous opponent.

Most of the things added in recent years do not fit with the established style:
Wisps and deadly six clash with the older designs like sore thumbs.

If it were for me, the games were doing great until adventure 2, and they should resume that setting. Sonic Heroes already started to show the first large cracks with simplification of plot and characters, and it kept getting worse and worse as we moved on.
I deeply dislike many choices of recent years, with no real continuity and declarations that do not fit anywhere (the "two worlds" thing is a very flimsy excuse to not stay consistent between games).

Speaking of the 30th anniversary...I have been very, very disappointed.
Subjectively speaking, there is nothing I care about. The announcements were so underwhelming, and after 3 years of silence too!

Colors feels to me like a quick recycle of a game I disliked. A recycle they brought out last minute because they had nothing on hand (and they didn't even complete yet!).
Origins...I've been playing the games in that compilation for 25 years, I own multiple copies of them. Great for those that missed on them as those are the good games.
The very plain video announcement for a game two years from now hurts me instead of making me hyped.
I just felt like the message was "You'll celebrate the 30th anniversary during the 31st anniversary!"
 
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Lightnik

Certified Sonic Maniac
Apr 27, 2021
8
1
23
23
an ancient past
I agree in part I liked the most serious stories of the Adventure era I grew up in that era is my childhood

but i don't like the american canon i grew up with the japan canon the american canon is unnecessarily exaggerated seriously why knuckle the guadian of the master emerald would abandon his duty to be a guard in an amusement park I do not understand

in case you're wondering this is taken from the knuckles chaotix american manal and seriously you call that to be serious

if more serious stories were made I would also opt for them to be based on the Japanese canon but that's just my opinion
 
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Lightnik

Certified Sonic Maniac
Apr 27, 2021
8
1
23
23
an ancient past
I wish Robotnik got his black eyes back...
those eyes were scary he doesn't look like a human

well it wasn't really human according to archie it was a robot or something like that

Even if I don't like the American canon, I must admit that his interpretation of Robotnik was much better and I would like Eggman to act more like his American counterpart, not like the walking joke that he is today.
 

Dragonick

Hyper-super dragon!
Apr 19, 2021
2
9
13
It's like Sega saw the negative reception of 06 and the mixed reception of Unleashed and assumed that serious stories are too difficult to pull off. Then they made the polar opposite for years after that until they failed at that too. I hope they learn from this, and perhaps balance the two.
 
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Ketchup1018

Green Hill Zone
Dec 5, 2020
1
2
23
18
sonic has always been for all ages including kids, but now it seems that just because sonic is family friendly the writers don't have to try. catering to all audiences is not an excuse for mediocrity. 3&K and the adventure games managed to tell a great compelling story while keeping the E rating. the tone of this franchise shouldn't be dark and mature but it shouldn't be bubbly kindergarten stuff either.
 

JPC

Green Hill Zone
Dec 3, 2019
48
2
23
27
Sorry. But Sonic at this point I shouldn't be treated as a children's product nowadays. So I'm tired of his games almost always carrying the E rating and sometimes the E10+ rating.

Some platform games were already more aimed at a more adolescent and mature audience. If not, look at examples like Jak & Daxter, Conker, Oddworld and Megaman X.

If we go to games of different genres. Take Zelda and Final Fantasy as examples. Games that started out being aimed at the general public, but as that audience grew, those games had to adapt to that audience being older. Make a comparison of the first Final Fantasy that came out for NES with the upcoming Final Fantasy XVI so you know what I'm talking about.

In the case of Sonic, they didn't know how to adapt the games to an older audience. The closest was Sonic Adventure 1 and 2 which had a more complex and elaborate story, even more so if you play the Dark Story in SA2.

If they can't bring us a T-rated or M-rated Sonic, why don't they experiment with other universes. The Archie comics would be a good candidate, as they have a great story and extensive lore to make multiple stories based on different characters from different POVs, not just Sonic. And have those stories be aimed at older audiences.

I would like a game focused on Sally and the Freedom Fighters and their plans to reclaim their old home Mobotropolis, a game focused on Knuckles and Julie-Su and their constant clashes with the Dark Legion or a game focused on Lupe and the Wolfpack telling the origins of this character.
 

Quartzviel

Press Start Screen
Dec 12, 2020
4
2
8
25
Look, I really couldn't care less if the stories are "dark and mature" or "family-friendly" or whatever.

All I care about (which is interesting cus I don't care much for story) is that they are well-written, treat its cast with respect by characterising them well (especially in a way that appeals to a wide demographic in today's society, like the Sonic Movie does; this isn't the early 2000s no more), has a premise that actually makes sense (for example, adventure, environmentalism, industrialism, corporatism, naturalism, freedom-fighting, convenience culture, etc.) and doesn't introduce some weird or out-of-left-field idea like Sonic Team was infamously known to do in the 2000s.

Like, the stories don't need to try and be these grand tales or something Shakespearian, they just need to be decent, contextualise the gameplay, and just make at least some sense to the average person. Like, if Sonic Team is struggling with telling a story that is good and isn't viewed as trash by the mainstream, then they may as well not even bother and do what Mario does and just focus on the gameplay.
 

AppleHeck

Green Hill Zone
Jun 15, 2021
1
5
12
36
I don't get how anyone can seriously think "hmm yes I want a less family friendly Sonic" when the series one official attempt at this was considered by basically everyone to be an unmitigated disaster. The other attempt was pretty much a crazy person taking a comic franchise hostage and turning it into a giant nightmare that is ridiculed and made fun of nearly a decade after the man responsible was removed from the property.
 

Lightnik

Certified Sonic Maniac
Apr 27, 2021
8
1
23
23
an ancient past
Sorry. But Sonic at this point I shouldn't be treated as a children's product nowadays. So I'm tired of his games almost always carrying the E rating and sometimes the E10+ rating.

Some platform games were already more aimed at a more adolescent and mature audience. If not, look at examples like Jak & Daxter, Conker, Oddworld and Megaman X.

If we go to games of different genres. Take Zelda and Final Fantasy as examples. Games that started out being aimed at the general public, but as that audience grew, those games had to adapt to that audience being older. Make a comparison of the first Final Fantasy that came out for NES with the upcoming Final Fantasy XVI so you know what I'm talking about.

In the case of Sonic, they didn't know how to adapt the games to an older audience. The closest was Sonic Adventure 1 and 2 which had a more complex and elaborate story, even more so if you play the Dark Story in SA2.

If they can't bring us a T-rated or M-rated Sonic, why don't they experiment with other universes. The Archie comics would be a good candidate, as they have a great story and extensive lore to make multiple stories based on different characters from different POVs, not just Sonic. And have those stories be aimed at older audiences.

I would like a game focused on Sally and the Freedom Fighters and their plans to reclaim their old home Mobotropolis, a game focused on Knuckles and Julie-Su and their constant clashes with the Dark Legion or a game focused on Lupe and the Wolfpack telling the origins of this character.
I agree in part I do not think that Sonic has to leave the child public aside what they would have to do is find a balance in the story Although your idea is correct in my opinion it would be something great to see a more mature spin off
 

X Spranp

Green Hill Zone
May 26, 2021
26
10
22
If they do end up making a mature spinoff, please, for the love of god keep Robotnik as the main antagonist. I'm extremely disappointed whenever they shove Robotnik aside for another villain.
 

JPC

Green Hill Zone
Dec 3, 2019
48
2
23
27
But there are many villains in the Sonic franchise that have appeared in various series and comics that deserve to appear in video games.

I for one would like a game where Ixis Naugus is the main villain. Having an overhaul as a kind of necromancer that would be able to revive the dead as zombies and absorb the souls of their victims to survive.

Some series and comics have a very large universe and a very extensive lore, that when it comes to making a video game, it is very difficult to make a game that is focused only on Sonic as the main character or that the villain is almost always Eggman.

That's why the idea of creating the Mobius franchise that I mentioned several posts ago.
 
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Dragonick

Hyper-super dragon!
Apr 19, 2021
2
9
13
Sorry. But Sonic at this point I shouldn't be treated as a children's product nowadays. So I'm tired of his games almost always carrying the E rating and sometimes the E10+ rating.

Some platform games were already more aimed at a more adolescent and mature audience. If not, look at examples like Jak & Daxter, Conker, Oddworld and Megaman X.

If we go to games of different genres. Take Zelda and Final Fantasy as examples. Games that started out being aimed at the general public, but as that audience grew, those games had to adapt to that audience being older. Make a comparison of the first Final Fantasy that came out for NES with the upcoming Final Fantasy XVI so you know what I'm talking about.

In the case of Sonic, they didn't know how to adapt the games to an older audience. The closest was Sonic Adventure 1 and 2 which had a more complex and elaborate story, even more so if you play the Dark Story in SA2.

If they can't bring us a T-rated or M-rated Sonic, why don't they experiment with other universes. The Archie comics would be a good candidate, as they have a great story and extensive lore to make multiple stories based on different characters from different POVs, not just Sonic. And have those stories be aimed at older audiences.

I would like a game focused on Sally and the Freedom Fighters and their plans to reclaim their old home Mobotropolis, a game focused on Knuckles and Julie-Su and their constant clashes with the Dark Legion or a game focused on Lupe and the Wolfpack telling the origins of this character.
Are you implying Shadow the Hedgehog, Sonic 06 and Sonic Unleashed weren't serious?

Those games had serious stories, which many agree were pretty good (but in the case of Shadow, in places). They all managed to have an E or E10+ rating, too!
It doesn't need to have an M rating to have a deep and interesting story. For a game to have said rating, it would need to be gory, sexy, offensive, or all of the above, which are things that would almost certainly take away from an engaging Sonic story. I don't want to be worrying about death and tragedies while I play my fast hedgehog game!
In fact, Sonic SatAM, which you appear to enjoy, was aimed at kids, despite its mostly serious tone. It was a Saturday Morning cartoon, after all.
The E rating on many of these games doesn't mean it's aimed at kids at all. It means kids wouldn't be disturbed or traumatised by the contents of the game. It also stands for "everyone", not "kids".

However, I do agree that a spinoff featuring the Freedom Fighters or the SatAM universe would be fun.
 

X Spranp

Green Hill Zone
May 26, 2021
26
10
22
Tbh, thinking about it, I kind of disagree with you, serious Sonic games are outright boring at this point. SEGA has been trying to make serious games for a long time, and it's only made the franchise worse. All I want is a game with a story like the classic Sonic games, where it was just light-hearted and goofy.
 

Sotaknuck

Scrambled Egg Zone
May 27, 2020
53
68
63
40
When where the classics goofy?

The problem they have recently is that they have not been able to make a "serious" story.
Serious doesn't mean it has to be gory or edgy or anything of the sort. The main issue they always had after Sonic Adventure 2 was the pacing of the story, and how incredibly grim they made it look but at the same time butchering it with bad execution and cringy dialogue.

Unleashed could have been serious, with minor adjustments to the dialogues it could have worked very well as a "serious" game.

On the contrary I can't buy that forces was a "serious" game. It definitely tried to be one, but it didn't *FEEL* serious at all thanks to how bad dialogues and scenes were pieced together. And Infinite that try so hard to tell you he is serious that overflows into bad comedy.
 
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